Ju EF82 Info request.

Flitzer

Flitzer

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Dear all
If I may be a pain in the seating area again... ::)


Following on from the German Twin-engined Carrier Aircraft thread I noted that the Junkers EF 82, apart from having a single powerplant of course, provision for a hook was possible should a carrier based version be required.


I would be very grateful if anyone has any 3-views or references to share?


Many thanks
P
:)
 
you mean the Ju EF82 ground attack Aircraft, based on Ju-187 ?
that what had to replace Ju-87 "Stukas"
 
Many thanks for the rapid response.


Michel, it is a ground attack and dive-bomber but I don't think it was based on the Ju187 as it was penned before the it.
But it was intended as a possible replacement for the Ju87.


I have an illustration and scale model pic, both on Page 33 of Luftwaffe Secret Projects G round Attack and Special Purpose Aircraft by Dieter Herwig and Heinz Rode.


Justo, if you don't have drawings, we are all doomed ;) .
Looks like another, guessed on my part, impression is required.
I'll take a stab at it and post...
It was to be powered by a single Junkers Jumo 214, had a front annular radiator and a circular engine cowling.


Best regards both
P
 
i needed the confirmation on ground attack and dive-bomber
i got only one picture of the Ju EF 82 scale model (from 1940?)

source: Junkers GMBH
 

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HI jENS
I've this but I don't understand !!!
 

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A better version of the above... ::)
 

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Translation:
"During 1939/1940 Junkers developed a single-seat midwing aircraft with the project number EF 82.
Contrary to the Ju 87, the famous Stuka”, the bombload of 1000 kg was carried internally. A widetrack
landing gear to be folded up into the wing, together with a arrester hook should enable use of the
type as a carrier aircraft. A specialty can be seen in the use of te Junkers Jumo 214, which was a
secret development of the Junkers aircraft engines branch and which wasn’t fostered by the
RLM, at a time, when the (German) aircraft industry was desperately looking for powerful engines.
Fitted with an annular radiator, the Jumo 214 was to be installed under a circular cowling.
Remarkable were the two exhaust stubs, non-standard to inline engines. No dimensions and
performance data are known, as well as no valuation by the RLM."
 
toura said:
THANK YOU jENS.
Click to expand...


Ditto Jens.


In the meantime....advice essential please.


First effort attached.
many thanks.


P
 

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I hope this can help you
after the Book "Die deutsche Luftrüstung 1933-1945" Band 3 by Heinz J. Nowarra
page 145
Junker EF Battle Aircraft with BMW 801 [engine] wat is a advances design of the Ju 187, a Singel seat craft in concept similar to early Iljushin IL-2
Click to expand...
 
Michel Van said:
[/q] Junker EF Battle Aircraft with BMW 801 [engine] ...
This probably was the EF 65, the forerunner of the EF 82, judging the text, which probably is based on the "Luftwaffe
Secret Projects" book. A model of the EF is offered via eBay. I've still difficulties in understanding, what is meant
with the "two exhaust stubs", or I should rather have written "exhaust pipes". What can be seen on the pictures,
to my opinion just is something like a flame dampener, or exhaust collector, not unusual at all, I think.
To me "two exhaust pipes" would mean something, as used for radial engines ( B ).
Click to expand...
 

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Thank you Jens.


Brilliant.



In the model pic, I can see the fuselage is much longer and more rectangular in cross section than my poor effort.
Back to Freehand....


P
 
I think, you shouldn't put too much faith in this model ! It's made from a Bird model kit,
but I would trust rather in what seems to be a manufacturers model, although it quite
probably isn't really a windtunnel model, as the prop and the camo wouldn't make any
sense. And honestly I cannot remember having seen other German desktop models from
that era before. But maybe someone modified a windtunnel model later ?
 
Yes there were desktop or display models built in Germany during WW II. When going through the photo archives of JFM , several have shown up.

Best regards,

Artie Bob
 
Just an idea: What looks like a rear view mirror, could be a "Rückblickfernrohr",
a rear view telescope, used for aiming a fixed rearward armament. Those weapons
were quite en vogue at the beginning of WW II and could have made some sense for
a single seat attack a/c.
 
Jemiba said:
Just an idea: What looks like a rear view mirror, could be a "Rückblickfernrohr",
a rear view telescope, used for aiming a fixed rearward armament. Those weapons
were quite en vogue at the beginning of WW II and could have made some sense for
a single seat attack a/c.
Click to expand...


my guess is this a "Richtstand" periscope like the Ju-388 but in this case there is another view mirror under the cockpit


also must the Ju EF82 have a Lotfernrohr "Lotfe 7" for Bomb drop or ground target attacks
it was used in Ju-88
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lotfernrohr_7
 
Michel Van said:
my guess is this a "Richtstand" periscope like the Ju-388 but in this case there is another view mirror under the cockpit


also must the Ju EF82 have a Lotfernrohr "Lotfe 7" for Bomb drop or ground target attacks
it was used in Ju-88
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lotfernrohr_7
Click to expand...

One type used was the "Rückblickfernrohr RF 1A", some explanations and photos/drawing can be found here:
C:\Dokumente und Einstellungen\BaganzJ\Lokale Einstellungen\Temp\bf-110e and f.pdf


If the Lotfe was used in single-seat airacrft, I'm not sure, because the combined workload of handling the
bomb sight and flying the aircraft might have been a little bit too much. And attack aircraft like that weren't
intended for high altitude bombing, I think.
 
Wow...many thanks...


This is beginning to take shape and it definitely points me, once again, in the right direction.


Many thanks
P
 
Just what the Doctor ordered.


Many thanks again Justo.
P
 
toura said:
Hi Flitzer and Justo
Click to expand...


I think this drawing's bomb bay position is correct.
Bomb bay center, air center(1/4 MAC) and center of gravity seems to be almost same position for me.
 
Thanks Justo!
I think Suisei's bomb bay center, air center(1/4 MAC) and center of gravity seems to be almost same position for me,too.
 

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I notice there is a small shallow intake aft of the bomb-bay doors on the illustration from the Luftwaffe Secret Projects book.
What would this feed so far back from the engine?



Where would this fit on with Justo's side view, same place?


Many thanks
P
 
Flitzer said:
What would this feed so far back from the engine?
Click to expand...

As long, as the Jumo 214 wouldn't have been fitted with a supercharger, I really don't know !
And to my opinion, a supercharger wouldn't make much sense for an attack aircraft, as it
would mainly fly at lower altitudes.
I would rather trace this detail back to "artistic freedom" ... :-\
 
Thanks Jens...
I was hoping someone would say this.... :)




P
 
What if this intake is not for supercharger, but for cooling the engine radiator ?
 
The Jumo 214 was an inline-engine, so much we know for sure, I think, although details aren't available
still yet. But I would think, that it was similar to the Jumo 211 or 213. This relationsship and
the appearance in the model suggests, that it would have used a radial radiator for the pressurized
cooling system, that made for a relatively compact engine, reducing frontal area and easing
engine replacement. A radiator placed elsewhere in the aircraft would have spoiled those points,
I think.
And a look on Justos drawing, showing the bomb bay makes clear, that any ducting to the engine
would have met difficulties, contrary to, say the Mustang, which, as a fighter had a lot of "empty
space" in the fuselage.
 
Hi Jens, the Jumo 214 was a Jumo 213 with a hollow shaft, allowing the provision of a cannon firing through the propeller hub.
 
Semi-fictional drawing from
"Schlachtflugzeuge und Kampfzerstörer 1935-1945-Band III"
Motorbuch Verlag 2002
with inline Jumo and underwings Mk 103/30 antitank guns
 

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"As long, as the Jumo 214 wouldn't have been fitted with a supercharger, I really don't know !
And to my opinion, a supercharger wouldn't make much sense for an attack aircraft, as it
would mainly fly at lower altitudes." Esentially all WWII full size aircraft engines were supercharged. The high altitude engines usually had either turbochargers, two stage, or variable speed superchargers.

Best regards,

Artie Bob
 

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